This is the first in a series here at Globatron, where we are going to acknowledge a growing cultural collision occurring right now in our world, in a way that differs from the approved media portrayal. In other words, we are going to take it for granted that a holy war is under way, between the East and the West, and we invite our readers to comment, discuss, dialogue about these conflicts, in order to come to some conclusions that might be slightly more provocative than those given to us when we utilize proscribed politically correct means.
So, have at it…In this episode I present a wonderful interview with Tony Blair by John Stewart, where the idea of the ‘Holy War’ itself is skirting around, and so here I wonder, does everybody agree that we are fighting a war about culture?
18 Comments
universaltron
September 16, 2010Some questions for all:
Why is it an issue IF President Obama is a Muslim?
Why was religion a huge talking point during the 2008 election?
Why were the first televised talks or debate between McCain and Obama moderated by a Christian, Pastor Rick Warren.
http://scottthong.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/rick-warren-interviews-obama-and-mccain-on-christian-faith-matters-video-and-reviews/
After this talk the media asked if Obama was Christian enough and now he continues to be called a Muslim. The answer Obama should have answered these accusations of being a Muslim with, and this pisses me off still today, why does it matter what religion I am?
If this is not a holy war these types of questions would not be there to be asked as they would be non-issues.
Akbar Lightning
September 16, 2010here are a few of my questions…
1. are there cultural differences that ought to be discussed in terms of freedom and politics…in other words, ought the arab world be entitled to freedoms, concerning the subjugation of women, when we feel differently about equal rights, and if so, what are we to do, especially if we do not believe violence to be a proper approach?
2. how are such cultural differences tied to climate and regional differences…do cultures derive from certain landscapes, and how ought we to address that.
3. what is our relationship to dress, and modesty, and gender roles? i was at a school board meeting where they were discussing uniforms for the teachers because a few of the teachers were wearing shirts that some parents found too revealing…how were we different, in our expectations, from other cultures…a group of people deciding on the body exposure of other people then going about enforcing it.
universaltron
September 16, 2010I’ll try to answer them for you. Why not?
1. yes. this is too complex for our current black and white approach to politics. the either your with us against us attitude of our war machine does not compute with you’re either kind of with us or kind of against us…. unless there is a lot of money involved. example: China.
2. if you mean by landscape, historical context then I’d say yes. these issues should be addressed according to religious custom. we should try and understand the custom and see how these customs are similar to our own and see how we can relate in a more global and historical sense.
3. good for you for attending a school board meeting. bravo. you answered your own question here, illustrating a similarity in custom. our likeness should be what is targeted to illustrate in the media not our differences. what else do we do that is similar in practice? it would seem religious intolerance is alive and well in the U.S. as well.
Infiniversal John
September 18, 2010A thriving and hardy ecosystem is said to have high biodiversity, with many species each adapted to an environmental niche. I think the high biodiversity helps the system be resilient in the face of disaster and other forces of substantial change.
There is an ecosystem of cultures within and among the human species.
Surely, landscapes and bioscapes play a role in shaping human culturescapes. The prevalence of terrain-features, animal and plant life in mythology is testament to this. Brains, minds, and cultures, have been shaped and adapted by the types of foods in the environment, and by the methods used to procure those foods.
Some culturescapes are rich with ideas, intelligence, originality, rich with sub-cultures, compassion, knowledge, and rich with history.
Some culturescapes are rich in some things such as history, but may be poor in other things such as intelligence, knowledge, and compassion.
An old culture may be seen as the legacy of the ancestors of a people. It can be a task to dig through the legacy and decide what to keep and what to toss. Some people (and peoples) have not been up to this task, and they have preferred to keep systems in place that serve them but may oppress others. Some people have hoarding tendencies and just don’t want to toss anything.
Is it up to all of us to create new culturescapes, new cultures and sub-cultures, and to offer the world new approaches to the same old questions of how to live, and what to believe, and what to value?
Is it up to all of us to create new culture that is appealing and accessible to the maintainers of old culture, so that we may all transcend many of the played-out forms of human suffering?
Will the best forms of new culture include the most valuable parts of old culture?
Even as we remove old forms of suffering and oppression, will new forms of suffering and oppression take their place?
I would say there is a high diversity of human culture on earth (but it’s not like I have another planet for comparison). Does this diversity afford protection against potential threats? What are some potential threats? Anything that greatly changes the game might be seen as a potential threat. Visitation from extraterrestrials could change the game. Global climate change could change the game. Economic collapse could change the game. Widespread famine could change the game. Scientific discovery can change the game. New technology can change the game.
And new culture can change the game.
universaltron
September 18, 2010As much as I appreciate the perspective and the way this last comment was stated I must disagree.
Humans share 99.9 percent of the same DNA among ourselves. We came from a tribe of 600 or so folks they now believe. There is little genetic difference from a human from one part of the planet to the next. So I don’t believe that landscape or culturescape can be reason for answering why there are such drastic differences between cultures. The proof is in the pudding or in the DNA. We are all alike. Mostly that is. We share so much in common that in fact there are similar architectural structures throughout the world built by different cultures in different times, sharing the same math to build them, because we share the same genes.
Just my thoughts on it. We are such a young species that to pigeon hole our differences in perspectives to our landscapes of origin of birth would be a mistake and disservice to the potential of the human mind and human genome.
Akbar Lightning
September 18, 2010well, culture is not a genetic event, not necessarily…so it is well within reason to think that differing geographies can manifest in cultural differences…the genetic similarities might work to remind us about our shared potential, but actual expression of potential might be strongly influenced by geographical forces…
i would imagine living in the desert would change my personal perspectives quite a lot…perhaps leading me toward particular modes of thinking…
globatron
September 18, 2010well. I would not argue agains it. i just don’t believe in it. i believe your perspective would not be supported by the desert but by the dogma that came out of the desert. And sense the Jewish, Christian and Muslim religions have a similar root (all coming out of the desert at some time in their history as well) I would say the argument would be wiser to focus on the differences between the three religions and cultures (many cultures) that they have spawned.
The reason I say this is that we have similar fundamentalism here in the West as in the East, but its being propagated in multi-million dollar suburban high-rise churches and convention centers.
Continuing Example:
http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/09/18/gingrich.values.voter/index.html?hpt=T2
The same tools of hate and fear are being used to separate and alienate by both sides. The weapons we choose to use are different to spread that hate. Carpet bomb vs. car bomb (good idea for a poem).
So I would say its best to focus on our genetic likeness. Focusing on our differences I believe will only serve to continue the separation that this type of dogmatic thinking grows.
Akbar Lightning
September 19, 2010it is a good point, the idea that the religions originate in the desert…but one could say that the desert of the past is what is still haunting us…those historical memories..and that some people are still living in that ancient land…
and so, just because christianity started in the desert, does not mean it now resembles what it once was….perhaps the western ideology has been affected by its movement through different geographies, creating a strong misunderstanding between the two peoples…
i am not convinced of these ideas totally. however, there is an element of western thinking that must be questioned in order to deal with people, many of whom live quite differently than we do…people who live very closely tied to very arid land and work toward survival, rather than toward ideas and the arts…
when i had that idea for globatron to reach out to afghan artists, i was shocked when i started googling, and realized how little in this virtual space could be found over there, and it dawned on me the great disparity between our world and theirs…there literally is no ‘artworld’ over there…at least not accessible to our western technology.
i don’t know where i am going with this, but i also am not attached to an answer…
Infiniversal John
September 19, 2010There is evidence that human evolution has been accelerating in recent millenia:
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http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN1043228620071210
“Human evolution has been moving at breakneck speed in the past several thousand years, far from plodding along as some scientists had thought, researchers said…”
more:
“For example, Africans have new genes providing resistance to malaria. In Europeans, there is a gene that makes them better able to digest milk as adults. In Asians, there is a gene that makes ear wax more dry.
The changes have been driven by the colossal growth in the human population — from a few million to 6.5 billion in the past 10,000 years — with people moving into new environments to which they needed to adapt, added Henry Harpending, a University of Utah anthropologist.”
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I imagine that cultural operating systems (to borrow a phrase from McKenna) have influenced human genetics, and vice versa. The genome is much more plastic and adaptive than previously thought. I’m sure there is an interplay between culture and genetics, and then the question is how significant is the interplay.
Humans may share a great amount of DNA, but even small genetic differences can be associated with significant phenotypic differences, as shown by the many physical and physiological features that are specific to populations of specific geographical origins. Potential of “psychological traits” among a population I think is an area worth exploring.
I wonder if there will be more splintering of human culture and genetics to come. The potential of transhumanism might lead to an increase in the diversification of intelligent beings.
I think there is beauty in all of the differences humans share, and it is worth focusing on both our similarities and our differences.
The act of focusing on similarities contains the implication that differences do exist.
If there is a best approach, maybe it would be to focus on the values and usefulness of both similarities and differences, and to avoid the trap of unnecessarily fearing differences, and avoid the trap of unduly aggrandizing or devaluing traits (and cultural inclinations?) that may be specific to a given population.
Probably this is an area of discussion well suited to careful and circumspective language.
I agree with you Globatron that toxic fundamentalism has been seen in many parts of the world, among a variety of populations.
Infiniversal John
September 19, 2010related to the potential of desert life forcing an emphasis on mere survival at the expense of pursuing pure art and ideas… I have been thinking in recent months that a hyper-organized (and somehow decentralized) healthy food system on earth might be effective in reducing war. Food and education are so basic.
I wonder tho, if by the time we solve world hunger, will we already be slipping into new bionic bodies powered by the light of our own imaginations…
Akbar Lightning
September 19, 2010all good points infiniversal John…(like the Little John, of Globatron’s merry men)…i agree with everything you said in your last two comments…the plasticity effect…
i’ve been thinking a lot about justice, about progressive politics, and how we have so little power to enact the positive changes we see possible, and therefore, we are, in a paradoxical way, freed by this to explore a wider expression of linguistic exploration…as we do not have to bind our language with political considerations, since it is impossible in some way to argue for justice, for if argumentation could change the world for the better, we would not be struggling the way we do…
i am not saying that progress does not occur, and i am not claiming that a person cannot participate in said progress…what i am saying is that politically engineered speech is not going to get us there…in fact, there is a vast realm of experience that we fail to share with one another, and in this there are considerations of genetic difference, geological realities, culture and gender dynamics, and how all these relate to our preferred futures.
this is why i started this holy war thread, to get at the heart of these issues, and perhaps escape from tired platitudes about how we ‘should all get along’ and try and figure out why we simply are not getting along…because very few left-wing tending people will admit that they too have inner conflicts about the relationship between the west and east. western civilization with all its freedoms and consequences…and eastern regimes with all their ideologies and consequences…
Infiniversal John
September 20, 2010I typed “future of humanity” into the search engine and a David Bohm youtube clip turned up, and now I’ve discovered another amazing person who graced earth with awesomeness.
Interviews with David Bohm:
http://www.thrivetalk.com/index.php?topic=281.0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0c1qvkOube4
I’ve known this feeling too Akbar Lightning:
“iâ??ve been thinking a lot about justice, about progressive politics, and how we have so little power to enact the positive changes we see possible, and therefore, we are, in a paradoxical way, freed by this to explore a wider expression of linguistic exploration…”
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Bohm talks in his interviews about the importance of dialogue, and consciousness, and he mentions differences between eastern and western philosophy.
Maybe with freedom of recognizing our smallness and the seeming futility of our efforts comes the recognition that our expansive and less-fettered discussion can be a powerful catalyst for co-creating the changes we envision.
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“western civilization with all its freedoms and consequencesâ?¦and eastern regimes with all their ideologies and consequencesâ?¦”
Maybe in some ways the wearing of ideologies is seen by some to be freeing, because it may reduce the energetic burden of engaging in the act of thinking about certain things.
And maybe when there is less or no thought, there is seemingly greater feeling and awareness of a spiritual existence.
World views, world views. So many different world views. What am I to do in this world of world views?
Can I bid adieu to every world view, and approach every moment anew?
I see spectrums and extremes within all things, and I think I’ll allow that view to continue streaming into my dream, as long as I see it as applicable and useful and desirable and appropriate.
Back to DNA. Maybe we are pre-wired by DNA in some ways, but I think we can rewire ourselves. We can modulate DNA with our thoughts, and diet and lifestyle. Every little thing we do is an interaction with our DNA.
And maybe there is a pure consciousness or mindness that permeates all existence (and is all existence), and while this consciousness can probably be molded by DNA and geography and culture, I think any human can birth a kind of godhead. And what is a godhead? Hmmm, I guess I haven’t given that too much thought…
I wonder if even a mouse can sprout and claim it’s godhead. Well, with science and animation, and imagination, maybe anything is possible:
Pinky and The Brain Intro: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJPFSNu_QNs
Holy wars, wholy wars.
Wen Ho Lee: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wen_Ho_Lee
Whole e-
When will the whole electron be realized?
“A lightning discharge consists primarily of a flow of electrons.[110] The electric potential needed for lightning may be generated by a triboelectric effect.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electron
“The triboelectric effect (also known as triboelectric charging) is a type of contact electrification in which certain materials become electrically charged after they come into contact with another different material and are then separated (such as through rubbing).”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triboelectric_effect
A lot of people on planet earth have been rubbing together, and have become very charged.
Can… should… all charge be discharged? Can it be transmuted? Can it be silenced, or given a benign voice… or a voice that is good for all? Who decides what is good for all? Maybe that is where the godhead comes into play.
universaltron
September 20, 2010The interview David Bohm is amazing and I feel it is as if I’ve said nearly the same things over and over. It’s as if these ideas have become mainstream.
I’m interested in your ideas of DNA and how you think humans have/will evolve quicker. The fossil record shows it took 150,000 years or so for us to evolve so we could use specialized tools.
That Reuters article is amazing. Wowzerpants. I had no idea evolution was happening that quickly. It would seem mother nature is helping us adapt to our environment. What will be next? Will our thumbs be larger for texting?
Will we develop the ability to live underwater since our waters will be rising? Will we swim with the fish?
Will we develop the ability to bend space and time and leave this planet? Will we merge with our technology and become immortal?
Does it matter?
David Bohm is my new hero. Thanks for sharing him.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Bohm
another one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJVnw_ThuE4
Infiniversal John
September 21, 2010Thanks, that Bohm clip you posted was the first I came across when I searched future of humanity. The sound wasn’t coming loud enough on my laptop, but maybe I can hear it better on another computer. I’d like to gobble up a bunch of Bohm stuff as I have with McKenna.
This article talks a bit about viewing DNA and science more holistically, and about the plasticity of DNA. I’m sure more is known today about how DNA works:
http://www.i-sis.org.uk/paris.php
Hmm, does the article talk, or does the author talk? Is the article the author? Is my voice scattered all over the internet? Am I talking to somebody right now via a post I made years ago on some website?
Kurzweil talks about how our technology has been growing exponentially, and if that is true then I would imagine our biology has been pushed and pulled similarly.
I’m not up on all the research on human evolution and DNA, except that I’m aware of some of the puzzle pieces such as that reuters article (and other articles about the same research).
Here a man talks about how humans want to upgrade their physical forms:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5OHnmF_nx8
Will humans move beyond DNA one day, and find a better way?
Will transhumans arrive in the blink of an eye and then rapidly further morph into something totally unrecognizable to our present imaginations?
A lot of people play video games today. Somehow reality and virtual will merge:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySvev6h6vf0
I think evolution is becoming a self-directed thing. We will change our bodies and our minds in accordance with what drives us. What drives us?
Greg
September 21, 2010Hi people. Was reading this and was moved to comment. I think the strange thing is that there is a urban myth, theory, whatever you want to call it that the key figures in the developments of all the theologies are the same person in various bodies. I for one really believe that and the same message was taught but perceived differently by the various cultures. And as man does so well, he perverted the message and knowledge into a religion. As the movie Dogma stated. Man took a great idea of faith and turned it into a religion. Faith is what matters. Not religion. Now the cultural differences that have transpired from the that issue is another realm altogether. I know the cultural acceptances and norms of the Muslim society are unspeakably barbaric to us in the West. But as Star Trek tried to show us many many times, we will never find peace until we find acceptance of other cultural norms. But norms that violate our very core foundational beliefs, equal rights, human rights, right to life. That is where I think the issue is. How do we justify not reacting when they stone a female for being raped? Or for having an affair with a man? To death?
I guess I am not saying I have any answers but I think if the messiahs were here now, (Jesus, Allah, Buddah, Mohommed and the others that came forth to provide our teachings, they would be dismayed at the state of the human condition. I won’t say I am any better, I am a man after all. But people ask, what would Jesus do, I think he would weep. Uncontrollably. I also think there is a strong possibility the prophets that we had were extraterrestrial in nature. I know, but there is WAY too much evidence that has been found that we have been visited a lot to ignore the possibility that someone has already been down this path and was trying to warn us. I find it highly likely other civilizations went down this path and in the process of seeding worlds to continue their species they tried to teach the seedlings how to live to prevent the downfalls they already experienced. Who knows. I would not be surprised to find something close the Star Trek IV happening where they finally return and go WTF? Really? Is this the message you guys heard? You guys are morons! 🙂 Provide us with a universal bitch slap. Anyway, this Greg reporting from Sunshine Land, home of the evil corporate mouse. Peace out peeps.
Akbar Lightning
September 22, 2010yes greg, jesus would weep…fo sho
as you will hear in our upcoming podcast, we discuss the differences between biology and spirituality…
this theory about E.T. visitation is one i want to address, because there is a material reality that is not necessary…
what i mean is that in some way i can totally agree with you…
but, what if the form of visitation is simply an inward divine inspiration…in other words, what if there was a god-like intelligence, and it did not need alien bodies, since it could simply communicate directly with the electrical computer known as our brain…
so, i am saying this to point back to spirituality as a possible place of validity..
Greg
September 22, 2010Perhaps, but case in point, there was a show with Leonard Nimoy hosting/narrating a long time ago. About unexplainable events or facts. They found a spherical object in Egypt about 40-50 years ago, it appeared to be a rock, they found it’s exact shape to be odd to be so perfectly round. After examining it with x-rays and other scans they found the interior contained highly complex mechanical features whose purpose was unknown. When they carbon dated the item it dated back almost 6000 years so obviously beyond the technology of any civilization at the time. Yeah so I think we were visited, perhaps seeded by and alien race. who knows.
There are more stories like this that are suppressed and ruled out as hoaxes, call me weird but TOO much evidence exist to the contrary.
Akbar Lightning
September 22, 2010i am certainly not discounted the idea that there have been physical visitations…that is not my point…
but let’s not forget that spiritual visitation might have larger, more deeper messages to contemplate…since such spiritual visitation might possibly be more intrusive, more comprehensive than the occasional space-ship…
obviously i don’t know either way, but our history does point to the presence of spiritual wisdom, as a guiding principle of civilization..